My version of electrical problems

[mtcrss2006]

Issues: Zero controls on the drivers door work. Memory seats, Power mirrors, Power Windows, Power Locks.

Solutions tried: Checked fuse, swapped power seat circuit breaker with window circuit breaker, 3 different drivers door modules (2 from junkyard, 1 from 00Harofreak).

Each window will go down from the respective switch, excluding the driver. I'm currently pulling all the water out of the floor boards but no wires look bad. The seat, b pillar cover, and carpet are pulled right now. According to the wiring diagram from Archon, Connector C1 at the door module should have power at A8 and A7 at all times, but it only has power at A8. By jumping A7 and A8, the radio and A/C shut off (woops) but windows still didn't work...unless the jumper disconnected when I looked at the radio.

The wiring under the carpet has about 12 different orange wires and i can't figure out which one goes to the door by continuity, though I've pricked myself about 5 times with the multimeter.

Are grounds the next thing I need to check? I can't seem to find where any are. Anything else that I'm missing? The tubing the wires are in has been hacked up before, so I'm probably not the first to dive into this issue.

[1fatcat]

According to the wiring diagram from Archon, Connector C1 at the door module should have power at A8 and A7 at all times, but it only has power at A8. By jumping A7 and A8, the radio and A/C shut off (woops) but windows still didn't work...unless the jumper disconnected when I looked at the radio.

Do the radio and a/c work after removing the jumper? Does A8 still have power after removing jumper? Sounds like A7 is broken somewhere. It feeds from the rear fuse block under the back seat. I don't know if you've looked back there or just in the door, but I think I have seen people here have corroded wires under the back seat/carpet area near the drives side.

[mtcrss2006]

Everything worked once the jumper was removed. A8 still has power.

I connected A7 to a known +12v source (the thicker orange wire) and it blew the DRV MOD fuse. This could mean A7 has come apart and shorted to ground....

The voltage difference between A8 and A7 is about 12 volts so I was thinking A7 may be shorting somewhere. BUT there is infinite resistance between A7 and ground, so I'm puzzled.

In an effort to prove that A7 was indeed the issue, I cut the wire about 4 inches back and connected the module side to the good 12v thick orange wire and left the suspected short to hang. Though it didn't blow the fuse, it didn't work either.

I'm lost.

[1fatcat]

Ok, hang on. It looks like A8 comes from the rear fuse block and feeds the DDM and then the DDM feeds the window switch through A7. Is that right? I was wrong to say A7 gets its feed from the rear block.

If that is correct, then A7 is a 12v output of the DDM and it would show no power with the DDM unplugged.

[mtcrss2006]

I believe you are correct, but I have no power there. hmmm, maybe when I try the switch? Still no... But I wish I had about 3 more hands to hold probes/flip switches/hold grounds.

Oh well. Sun's about to start setting and I gotta drive her tomorrow so she's getting put back together. Thanks fatcat, I'll probably revive this thread on my next day off... Next thursday, the 12th.

[myfirstbonnie]

I have a feeling we are going to see a lot more of these issues. Check out my thread on the driver's door issues. viewtopic.php?f=18&t=19236&hilit=serial

Check all the wiring from the door through the harness connector in the door jamb.

[mtcrss2006]

Pulled door jam connector (C500) out, and disconnected it. On the door side, I pulled each wire individually away from the connector but nothing came out or felt loose. On the car side of the connector I probed all the wires for consistency with the FSM. All checked to be ok, but I'm not sure what the serial data signal voltage is supposed to be.

Also, Pin T on C500 came out with 12v. It is labeled circuit 640. Now A7 (and A8 for that matter) is also labeled to be circuit 640, so I'm thinking either there is an open circuit between the door jam and Pin A7 on C1 on the Driver Door Module. A1fatcat and I agreed earlier that it should be power coming out of the Driver Door Module, but wouldn't that be a different circuit number?

Is there a way to test a Driver Door Module? I've tried the 3 different ones but 2 came from a junkyard where they may have gotten wet.

Grrr I want to put my windows down while this weather is beautiful. :(

[myfirstbonnie]

A8 is the battery supply to the DDM. A7 is the output from the DMM to the window power. If you go to the schematic for the power windows (page 8-858) you will see that DDM pin A7 goes to the power window switch in the drivers door and provides the battery voltage there.

If you have power to A8 and the module is plugged in, you should have power on A7 (with key in run position).

In the picture is my bad harness. The connector on the stool is the DDM connector and the 2 orange wires are A7 and A8. As you can see, the orange wire coming out and going to the right is going to the door connector. The orange one heading left, goes to the door switch connector.



There is something in the DDM that switches the power to that lead. It also feeds the power mirrors, door locks in that switch.

[myfirstbonnie]

Any update on this?

[mtcrss2006]

Tomorrow.

I'm going to pull the panel, check for power at A7, then switch out the module with the other 3 and check each one. If they all fail, I may be looking at trying to find one new... $300 :(

[mtcrss2006]

Holy crap, I have power at A7, and power at the window switch... had to cut some of the plastic insulator off the top of the probe so I could get in in there and voila.

So now I'm checking for power coming out of the switch back to the DDM, and that should activate one of the thicker wires to provide power to the windows, right?

Also going to check power to/fro the door locks and memory switches if I can find the right diagram.

[myfirstbonnie]

Has the driver's door window switch ever been wet? I am wondering if the window controls on the driver's door got wet and damaged the circuit inside. The power to all those functions are routed through that circuit inside the switch controls. If you have power to it and the ground is there, I am suspecting a faulty driver's door window control.

[mtcrss2006]

I just came back to say that! haha! All wires going to the switch do "something" when pressed. The only odd thing is I have 14 ohms resistance from the switch ground to chassis ground. But the serial data signal, which I'm guessing translates any physical function of the switch into an order for the DDM to read, never changes from 4.6v regardless of any switch input.

On another note, I have a big puddle of antifreeze under my car... and at first I thought it was someone else's, but when I started the car it started dripping bad. (A/C was off) :( Hope it's just a hose clamp but I'll check it in a little bit.

So I'm officially looking for a window switch. I'm guessing Andrew has one or a dozen of these, so here goes a PM. I'll let u know.

[myfirstbonnie]

On that serial data line you will not see a voltage change. It is nothing more than a bunch of very very high speed pulses and a DMM will see it as a constant DC voltage.

[mtcrss2006]

Oh... So there really isn't a way to check the switch without replacing it?

So the main ground connector under the seat is a pile of rust :(


I took a scratch pad to the bolt but I really need to clean the threads in the hole too.

[mtcrss2006]

It was the driver's window switch. Thanks a lot everyone!

I can now use the remote to unlock the doors, use the memory seats, mirrors, and 3 of the 4 windows! (The driver's window does a lot of clicking about halfway down and stops, but that's for another thread.)

And thanks to Andrew for having the parts!