Ugh. Got a BS ticket for speeding in an illinois work zone

[lewis26]

Not having a good day today.

I was on my way to work, feeling great because I actually was on time leaving my house today. I saw this particular officer was on the shoulder with his lights on, and it looked as if he had just finished writing a ticket. I continued down 355 north, and got into the local exits because the express lane is usually very backed up. I dealt with the traffic for I-88, and then got through the traffic and noticed the officer was in the express lane next to me (of course today the express lane isn't back up. If I would have taken it, I would have been 2-3 miles ahead of him). Now 355 is set up with express lane, 2 lanes of construction, and 2 lanes of traffic currently. There are only barrels separating the construction, from the traffic lanes.

Here is the interesting part. Yes the speed limit is 45mph, but traffic was doing 55-60, especially because there were no men working in the current area. I went around the curve under i-88, continuing along at 55-60, at the front of a small pack. Mr officer then darts over to the local lanes behind me and pulls me over, saying I was doing 71 in a 45, and that he was pacing me. There is no way that's true, and simple math proves him wrong. On a curve, for 2 objects to appear in line, the one nearest the outside must be going faster than the one on the inside. These lanes are probably 15 feet wide, so this puts him 60ft wider on the arc than I am.

I tried explaining this to him, but he wasn't having it. He writes me the ticket, and says "have a better day." jacka$$. It gets better though. he wrote the ticket for $75, but a court appearance required. The cost for a first time offense in a construction zone is $375. I know that when I go to court, they are going to up the cost to that $375.

I have sent a copy to our close family friend who is a state officer, and is the head of all road units in the state of Illinois. I want to see what he says about it.

I'm trying to decide my best court of action. I can plead guilty and cite my ticket says $75 and hope they uphold that amount. I can plead not-guilty, and state that the process he used to pace me was mathematically incorrect. But the issue with that is what I know I was actually speeding, but so was EVERYONE else behind or in front of me.

Ugh, what a crap start to the day.

[SSEi95]

Double edged sword. The fact you were speeding in a construction zone, regardless of people around you, is enough to warrant a ticket. Now getting you with 75 instead of 55-60, that you can argue. What I would check on is to see what the threshold is for higher fines. Speeding in the zone at 55 might be $200 cheaper than the same offense at 75.

[lewis26]

The issue becomes that it was a work zone. 1mph over in a work zone is $375.

But the officer wrote Individual Bond (full amount) at $75.


I'm just wondering that If I can prove the officer's pacing was wrong, the ticket will be thrown out. It should be, as it says on the ticket that I was doing 71, so if I can prove that wrong, they cannot prove how fast I was truly going.

[J Wikoff]

If they know the radius of the curve you were on, they can prove how fast you were going based on the officer's 71 mph.

In this case:

vehicle speed = (radians per second) * (radius of curve)

71 mph = RPS * ROC

Your speed = RPS * (ROC - 60 feet)

Plug in the ROC from roadwork plans to the 1st equation to determine the RPS. Plug the RPS and ROC into the 2nd equation, and they'll have your speed.

[lewis26]

That is assuming a perfect curve, and perfect pacing from 4 lanes over by the officer.

Plus, I dont have any idea what the radius of the curve is. It also is not a constant curve, but actually tightens as you move farther through it.


The issue becomes that if the ticket can be thrown out because of his pacing technique.

[willwren]

Google Earth can help with the radius of the curve. Post a screenshot.

[BonneMe]

You wont get it thrown out, you've admitted to being well over the limit to us, and any amount of mathematical equations isn't going to just get the court to change their mind.

If it doesn't say construction zone on the ticket, do not bring it up AT ALL.

[lewis26]

The violation code he used for construction zone, and for infraction he put "speeding in construction zone."

But for bond, he put individual bond(full) amount: $75

Here's the location:
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... 38581&z=15

[J Wikoff]

Given a normal curve, it'd have to be 104ish feet in radius. That's pretty small for a highway.

[lewis26]

I'm not exactly sure where you're getting 104 feet in radius. It is somewhere near a mile in radius.

I was on 355, going under 88. He pulled me over right before 355 went into the left hand turn.

[harofreak00]

It looks like its about a 1900ft radius at the tightest part of the turn, where the blue, red and green boxes are 500ft squares.

[J Wikoff]

104 ft is what the radius would have to be if you were going 45 mph, and the cop paced you at 71 mph from 60 feet further from the center.

[lewis26]

Alright so that gets me to 65ish, which is still too high, and far higher than I was going.

There is an additional equation that is used for pacing police cars. It takes into account the accuracy of the pacing

It uses speed clocked at/(1+(distance paced at/distance paced))

So that becomes 65/(1+(.25/.75)) = 48


yes 48mph is above 45, but If I can prove this in court, I think I would be able to use the other 3mph on speedometer error in my car and his.

[Allmachtige]

I dunno, Illinois is pretty rough on road laws, but good luck.

I'm actually surprised you're in a such a mess for that area.

[JimmyFloyd]

Is pacing legal in your state for an accurate measure of 71 MPH? Does the Cops Speedometer have marks for individual miles? Is an error on the ticket for cost legally binding for you? I know several tickets my friends have gotten because the officer messes up plate numbers, or vehicle make and models, so you might be able to get it at $75 due to that.

Not sure if any of this will actually help you, just throwing out ideas

[lewis26]

After speaking with our friend who is a very high up state officer, It will be $375, regardless of how he paced me.

Because I cannot prove beyond a doubt that I was doing 45 or lower, I will get the ticket. The ticket will be corrected at the courthouse.

Not really happy about it, but what can ya do.

[myfirstbonnie]

Don't speed in construction zones. I know around here, the cops like to watch those areas a lot.

[mawint]

When I had to go to court for my ticket, the state had to prove that I was speeding. I didn't have to prove I wasn't but it could be a Minnesota thing, although you will probably have to comment on it and tell them your side of the story.

[lewis26]

Yeah, after speaking with some of state officer friends, I found out the scoop.

Bascically, in IL, pacing is considered an allowable measure of speed. I will have to go to court, admit guilt, and then get assessed a $375 ticket, with $250 worth of court fees.

It's ridiculous, but what can ya do.



Going 45 in morning rush hour traffic is suicide. You almost get killed by people cutting you off, and giving you the finger.


I got stuck in the wrong place in the wrong time.

Sh*t happens I guess.

[willwren]

I'm not sure I'd say it's ridiculous. There's a speed limit, you exceeded it. You had a choice to pull over a lane and go 5 over safely.

In the long run, the officer did his job, and the construction workers in your State are probably glad he did. No, I don't like to see any member of the Forum or any friend or family member have to pay a fine like this, but at the same time, you did break the law by exceeding the posted limit, and you knew you were in a high-fine construction zone. The purpose of the increased fines is to prevent deaths, which are pretty high for highway workers.

Lesson learned, nobody to blame but yourself, yet I sympathize with your situation nonetheless.