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PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:15 pm 
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Location: Oregon WCBF'04, '05, '06, '07, '08, '09, '10, '11 Survivor
Year and Trim: .
93 SSEi
95 SLE (SC)
97 Buick LeSabre
For those that followed the topic on the other forum, or are new to it. Due to other car issues, I never had the time to 'beef up' the first prototype before WCBF, and refused to run it without my LSD (which wasn't ready in time) anyway. Things have changed a bit now. The new motor is strong, the car is dialed in very well in it's de-tuned state, and I'm ready to move forward with what I hope will be the FINAL or permanent version, rather than a second prototype.

A little history first:
The Series 1 is a totally different animal to begin with. Raising the Supercharger with a traditional stacked-plate intercooler is impractical for two primary reasons. First, the nosedrive is actually attached to the accessory bracket, requiring expensive customization. Second, there are no inexpensive fuel rail solutions for the Series 1.

The good news is that there's room in the Series 1 LIM for a 'zero lift' intercooler that might have similar thermal capabilities to ZZP's short stack IC, and the Series 1 actually has more usable WIDTH inside than the Series 2 does. Many problems still exist though. A few pics of the first prototype showing the LIM and SC modifications:

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Pic showing the Series 1 manifold (left) and Series 2 manifold (right) and how the widths vary greatly in the plenum:
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Cross-section showing how the prototype's inlet and outlet were sealed against vacuum/boost leaks through the LIM wall:
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Testing proved it to work very well, but it had some weaknesses in my connections to the inlet and outlet of the inner (LIM) core (heat exchanger). That is essentially the only place that needs improvement in the design, and I'm working on a solution. Keep in mind I had to shorten the chosen heat exchanger to length requirements dictated by the LIM, and I'll improve those 'repair connections' as well this time around.

I'm also considering moving forward sooner than planned on a slushbox, and possible relocation of the front radiator for the intercooler.

FYI, I've already blocked off my EGR to keep the core clean, and need to replace the rotors in my IC-machined supercharger (have replacements already). I may also bypass/block the PCV. It's important to keep the IC core as clean as possible. Periodic use of my water injection (still plumbed into the TB) should help. I MAY add an inspection port to the LIM or SC that I can use later with a borescope to inspect the inner core by simply removing a threaded plug.

I'll keep this updated as I make more progress (current system is on the bench right now).

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PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:45 pm 
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97 Buick LeSabre
Found my container for my slushbox.

Thanks to whichever WCBF'er left this behind.


Image

And I'm not kidding. Perfect size.

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Click here for mod list for both cars
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PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 1:21 am 
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TenGHz wrote:
What's a slushbox? Is it like an ice box for an inner cooler?

Excuse my ignorance, it's just that every time I've heard that word used before was by ricers talking about automatic transmissions.


That's intercooler.

And its normally something like a copper coil placed in ice water I would imagine.

If I'm not correct...I'm probably on the wrong subject altogether. But seeing as a drought keg is insulated AFAIK...it would be correct for the application I'm thinking of...with a drain installed of course.

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Now: '15 Toyota Prius III | 134 hp 2ZR-FXE | Silver | 36k
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Then: '07 Ford Fusion SEL | 221hp Gen I VVT Duratec 3.0 V6 | Tungsten Silver | 150k
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Then: '11 Ford Fusion SEL | 240hp Gen II VVT Duratec 3.0 V6 | Ingot Silver | 84k | Totaled: Oct 23 '14 (Rear-Ended)
Then: '96 Buick Park Avenue Ultra | 240hp Series II L67 | Medium Dark Lichen | Bought: JAN 11 @ 135k | Accident: FEB 3 '12 | Crushed: MAR 1 '13 @ 153K
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Then: '93 Pontiac Bonneville SE | 170hp Series I 3800 L27 | Dark Yellow Green | Bought: JULY '07 @ 92k | Sold: JULY '12 @ 118k
Then: '89 Pontiac Bonneville LE | 165hp 3800 LN3 | Medium Garnet Red | Bought: JAN '05 @ 117k | Sold: SEP 30 '07 @ 152k


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 1:51 am 
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:bow: Your welcome Bill.

That really should make a nice intercooler chill box. :beerchug:

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 8:18 am 
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Yup. Copper coil enters and exits through the wall, coiled up inside. Fill it with ice, put the lid on. Drain it when it gets full. This is the only way to achieve intercooler temps below ambient, and is typically the last thing in the system before it hits the SC.

Local brewery has a beer tap they rent out with the same type of system. No icing of the key needed.

I'll have to insulate this can. It's single-wall.

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PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 1:12 pm 
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willwren wrote:
Found my container for my slushbox.

Thanks to whichever WCBF'er left this behind.


Image

And I'm not kidding. Perfect size.

I Like! =D>


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 9:06 pm 
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Quote:
Post subject: Re: Re-visiting the Series 1 Intercooler

willwren wrote:
Found my container for my slushbox.

Thanks to whichever WCBF'er left this behind.




And I'm not kidding. Perfect size.

I Like!
willwren wrote:
Found my container for my slushbox.

Thanks to whichever WCBF'er left this behind.


Image

And I'm not kidding. Perfect size.

I Like! =D>






what the beer or the idea

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 10:01 am 
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firebuick wrote:
what the beer or the idea



Yes and Yes :)


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 10:18 am 
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97 Buick LeSabre
I hate Heineken, but I guess technically, it's still beer. And I have to thank them for their contribution to the 'upgrade' part of my project.

One of the big things I wanted to accomplish is to have no mechanical connections (possible leak point) inside the LIM. It doesn't look like I can make that happen, considering the materials I have to work with and the limited space.

It will be far more 'robust' in design this time though. Through simplicity.

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PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 1:57 pm 
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At least it's the right color already, and if you insulate it, the Heineken logo will be covered up and you can do a Zilla Motorsports logo on the outside of the insulation.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 6:36 pm 
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Location: Oregon WCBF'04, '05, '06, '07, '08, '09, '10, '11 Survivor
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Hoping after it's all done, you'll never know it's not an OEM part under there.

Also have some new magic 'stuff' on the way in order to better seal the inner core after shortening it. Should know if it's successful sometime next weekend.

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PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 8:19 pm 
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Ever think of using something other than water to cool this off? For instance, how about hooking it up to a big bottle of CO2 and use the expansion of the gas to cool it off. Better yet, re-route your A/C so that this becomes your evaporator :) A race car doesn't need A/C, does it?

I said that as a joke but hmmm I wonder if that WOULD work?

Alternately, you could use your A/C system to cool off the water in your slushbox.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:39 pm 
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CO2 comes in a bottle and costs money, and is unsuitable for daily driving.

AC robs horsepower.

A traditional water-air intercooler can run full-time with no extra cost but a few amps to run the pump. Slushbox costs a bag of ice, and is only for the track or very hot trips.

Air-water intercoolers are far more efficient than air-air. I think I'm on the right track. :wink:
This version (not the one posted here, it's the prototype.....talking about the 'upgrade') has several improvements and should provide long-term reliability and performance.

While the prototype worked GREAT, it didn't have the durability I needed, and I knew it at the time. I needed something just good enough to prove the efficiency, then go back to the drawing board.

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Click here for mod list for both cars
93 SSEi, 95 SLE (supercharged) 97 Buick LeSabre Limited
PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:06 pm 
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So... what's happened in twelve years? I am taking on an old Series 1 L67 project. Any LIM and SC results are welcomed.

Cheers!


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2020 10:22 am 
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willwren hasn't posted in 8 years and nobody here is innovating for the series 1. You can consider this thread dead. If you want to start a new one feel free, but I'm going to lock this one up.

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