Ya as you told me a while back Will, I was looking @16's or 17s more than likely.

Here are my times and R/Ts
1)R/T 0.862---81.59 mph--1/4 time 17.018 sec needed better R/T big
2)R/T 0.748---82.28 mph--1/4 time 17.341 sec
3)R/T 0.654---82.13 mph--1/4 time 17.202 sec
4)R/T 0.726---80.56 mph--1/4 time 17.386 sec
5)R/T 0.460---80.47 mph--1/4 time 17.497 sec
6)R/T 0.466---82.16 mph--1/4 time 17.172 sec
I couldn't do better than the first run no matter how hard I tried for the first 5 runs. But I began to figure it out and by the 6th run I changed my start technique to brake pedal barely on to a quick switch to full throttle. I had been trying to use a technique I read about on the other ****forum where you hold the brake on and at the 2nd to last yellow on the tree you begin a little throttle then on green you let up the brake and go FT. That doesn't work. My problem as I left it was even holding the brake down at all. I feel like on the street I get better starts from a stop if I don't even think about the brake. At the track I felt like if I let up on the brake after staging to the line I'd inch past it w/o the brake.
The last run was just great. I did my worst on the run prior so I couldn't let it go at that. In the other lane seemed to be a small Honda. I got the jump on the start and I began to put a few car lengths between us. He got closer as we reached redline and I shifted up and lost a few feet on him as he stayed in the same gear. But he had to up shift and when he did that was it. I was in the powerband already and it was too late for him. He was in the same class with me.
I need work on my starts, but DO NOT want a ticket. I also need to learn just where the powerband is in my acceleration so I can shift right.

Last event like this is next Thursday and I plan to be there. I'd recommend at least Woodburn dragstrip as a place to show your car. It's casual and fun and is very inexpensive. Not to mention Gargantuan Muscle cars in full display. Makes you think huh?

I feel pretty appreciative of you guys.

_________________
2001 Bonneville SSEi. 1598xx mi.
great car. Wrecked


Burnt Bonny.

Note if you pull the injectors to obserbe fuel delivery...make sure you leave the plugs in and disconnect the ign. Believe me

What were your 60' times for each of those runs?

Your reaction times are pretty bad, but that's to be expected first time out. They'll come down as you learn the timing of the lights over time.

Working on your starts will be key, but it's not going to probably do much, and with the sinister chip, your car is probably shifting correctly. They know where the L27 should be shifting optimally, and I'd bet you your shift tables are correct for that. Did you have traction problems? Did you get a 'chirp' off the line? Did you break traction on any of the launches? Your car is running about where it should be, and your R/T isn't figured into the actual ET. But again, your 60' will show you how well you're launching. An exerienced driver would probably have been able to shave a tenth off your launch and ET.

The idea is to power brake up to a certain rpm, if it holds traction, hold a higher rpm on the next launch until you start to lose traction, then back it down a tad and use that. Power-braking gets you up into your torque band for the launch.

_________________

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Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers

yep, as bill said you need to find the rpms right before you break em loose on your launch and go with that.

and my suggestion on the r/t time (although it doesnt effect your e/t) is to go on the second yellow like its the green. thats what i did when i went to the track the first time and was able to manage a .009 r/t time. just a suggestion

_________________
-Matt

60' times
2.625
2.776
2.637
2.692
2.763
2.692

How do these numbers show how well I started?

GoldenBullet,
I think I will try that next Thursday. I've heard of that before. My method Was to hold the break slightly, bring the revs up a bit just before green and let go the brake at green. The problem with was that my revs would rise for about a second and then the motor boggs down to nothing in less than a second.
There was a car that got a flat 0 on the R/T, and next run he went .001. When I go WOT in waterbox it sure seams mean. If I could just transfer that much rise in torque in such a short time at the line I'd be happy.

I had zero traction problems Will. I never even barked tires outside of the waterbox. My technique is likely the cuplrit. No chirp either and I don't know what that is. Unless you mean a red light for jumping the gun which I didn't.

A tenth quicker would have put me in the 16's group. Something to work for.

As for the shift point sets it's all good except 2nd to third. With the shifter in 2nd the car auto shifts to third, but the revs were not redline. another 1000 rpm's would have been better imho.

Kris

_________________
2001 Bonneville SSEi. 1598xx mi.
great car. Wrecked


Burnt Bonny.

Note if you pull the injectors to obserbe fuel delivery...make sure you leave the plugs in and disconnect the ign. Believe me

If you had no traction problems, your 60' times mean nothing, and you weren't launching hard enough. You want to launch just hard enough to ALMOST break loose, and you want to hear a good 'CHIRP' when you go.

I'd say the car probably has another tenth of a second in it. Assuming you launch it to it's fullest potential.

_________________

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93 SSEi, 95 SLE (supercharged) 97 Buick LeSabre Limited
PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers

you shouldnt need to go in the waterbox unless you have drag slicks, its a waste of your tires otherwise, just go around it and just spin em a tiny bit to get of any water that you may have gotten on them.

_________________
-Matt

Did you remove the drivers side headlight? That will help out a lot! It will allow much more air to the CAI.

It helped me drop 4 tenths off my ET.

_________________

'93 SSE "Guinevere" RIP 1993 - 2019
'01 SSEi "Chloe" Mods: Intense FWI | GenV | WBS Intercooled | 3.2 MPS | 1.9 YT Rockers | SSAC Headers | N* TB | TEP Trans | 3.29 FDR | Torsen LSD
DTM Tuned | Dual AeroForce | Solid Mounts | 255 Walbro Pump | Fuel Logs | GXP STB & Sway Bars | CSS Lowering Springs | GXP Brakes | Disabled DRL
Magnaflow Mufflers | Magnaflow Cat | GXP Seats & Trim | 35 % Tint | Cleared & Tinted Tails | repinS Retrofited Morimoto Mini H1 | 19" GT500 Wheels
'09 G8 GT "Abigail" Mods: Rotofab | LS3 Heads, Intake & Cam | Kooks LT | Solo Exhaust | Tien Springs w/ GXP Struts | Whiteline Swaybars | BMR Subframe Connectors
Achievements: Guinevere - 264k mi | 16.27 @ 84.10mph | March '11 COTM :: Chloe - 223k mi | 13.85 @ 102mph | January '09 COTM :: Abigail - 192k mi | 12.85 @ 112mph

I did remove that headlight. The gates didn't even open until 2:30 and race was at 3. I couldn't find the rules and "what to expect" links at the dragstrips website so I left at 11:30, got their like noon. So I had a lot of time to tune. I want to cut out the metal in the chassis behind the headlight. That would help too. I wanted to change out my FPR for my new AFPR if you followed my thread in forced induction. My fuel pressure tests a lil low. I just didn't want to get in to that then. Wanted to check with Pontiac Bonneville Club.com first. What do you think; it could be the FPR or it could be the fuel pump or the filter (doubt it's the filter). How do It test the individual components in this set?
EDIT-

I'll start a thread in performance

_________________
2001 Bonneville SSEi. 1598xx mi.
great car. Wrecked


Burnt Bonny.

Note if you pull the injectors to obserbe fuel delivery...make sure you leave the plugs in and disconnect the ign. Believe me

Sorry, but

Removing the headlight on any car would get you about .005 at best. There's no way in H E L L it got anyone 4 tenths. There is no ram-air effect. It's a myth. The only time it'll help a little is from about the 8th to the 1/4, and it's too late to do jack for you at that point. Your run may have been 4 tenths quicker, but it wasn't from the lack of a headlight.

Don't bother cutting metal back there either. It won't do jack *shoot* for you.

That AFPR you bought is underrated for your car as we told you. Return it or toss it.

_________________

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93 SSEi, 95 SLE (supercharged) 97 Buick LeSabre Limited
PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers

"That AFPR you bought is underrated for your car as we told you. Return it or toss it."

"Don't bother cutting metal back there either. It won't do jack *shoot* for you. "

love to, thanks

_________________
2001 Bonneville SSEi. 1598xx mi.
great car. Wrecked


Burnt Bonny.

Note if you pull the injectors to obserbe fuel delivery...make sure you leave the plugs in and disconnect the ign. Believe me

We're here to help you, but only if you listen to the advice we give you from experience. The AFPR you bought will set your fuel pressure BELOW factory spec.

You are already below that point, probably due to your fuel pump, but possibly from your OEM FPR. That's for another topic though.

We can help you with your car, but only if you let us.

_________________

Click here for mod list for both cars
93 SSEi, 95 SLE (supercharged) 97 Buick LeSabre Limited
PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers

Lemme chime in a second on this subject...

Absolutely Stay Out Of The Water!!! You don't need it, and you don't want it.

You are running street tires. The purpose for going through the water is to lubricate the soft rubber drag tires so the racer can spin them up (cleaning the surface of the tire and heating the soft rubber compound up.) This doesn't work right on a street radial that is already fully vulcanized. It ends up being a waste of time, and has the risk of breaking something doing an unnessesary burn-out.

You are running in the 17's (which is not unexpected for a N/A V6 production car.) Work on your reaction time and your consistancy like the others have said. This is an opportinuty to learn on a car that's not so fast as to require your undivided attention piloting it down the strip.

_________________
Bye Bye 1990 Bonneville LE... Now it belongs to my daughter
In the Garage: 2009 Subaru Outback, 1987 Camaro, 2006 SV650S, 1995 Regal 182 "ASANAGI", 1962 Ford Galaxie 500, 1995 Ford F150 XL 4WD, 1953 Farmall Cub

Kris, While I was out having a smoke and thinking about your RT and ET numbers another thought occured to me.

It was pointed out earlier that your RT times are not included in the ET, which is true. What the scatter of times tells me is you need to concentrate a little more on setting up the car in the staging lights.

For example, your first run RT was the worst, yet it gave you the best ET of the night. What I think that is saying to you is that your RT on that first run wasn't as bad as the timeslip says it was. What skews the number is where the front wheels were in relation to the starting line.

When you stage, you roll forward until you break the "Pre-Stage" lights on the tree. You then roll forward a little more and break the "Stage" lights. You can actually creep even a little further forward and turn off the "Pre-Stage" lights while the "Stage" lights are lit. For a valid race to start, only the "Stage" lights have to be lit, the "Pre-Stage" lights on the tree are more for the driver's reference only. This is called "Deep Staging"...getting as close as you can to the true starting line. The RT is the difference between the green light comming on and the "Stage" light going out by crossing the start line.

What all this means is you can have a good true reaction time, yet have a rotten RT on paper just because your wheels were further away from the actual starting line...the time it took the car to advance a inch or two was included in your RT, making it bigger than it might have been if you were closer to the line when the timers started.

My advice if you are going to use successive time slips as a measure of your performance: Make sure you stage the car the same way every time. Deep, Shallow, in the middle, it doesn't matter if you are just getting started...so long as you do it the same way every time.

I hope that makes some sense. Drag Racing is kinda like shooting clay targets. It is such a deceptively simple game that anybody can comprehend the basics in a few minutes of instruction and jump right in to participate. However it takes a lot of effort to play the game well...sometimes years go by until feel like you can master it.

_________________
Bye Bye 1990 Bonneville LE... Now it belongs to my daughter
In the Garage: 2009 Subaru Outback, 1987 Camaro, 2006 SV650S, 1995 Regal 182 "ASANAGI", 1962 Ford Galaxie 500, 1995 Ford F150 XL 4WD, 1953 Farmall Cub

Spoiled94 did you have your traction control on or off ?

_________________
1993 SE mag.cat., K&N CAI, B&M drain plug, MSD wires, Energy Suspension end links, Monroe sensotracks,3.06gears,F41,N10,adj.modulator,180 degree stat. SilverStar Ultra highs and lows,TR55 plugs,DEX VI,front trans mount mod.

"When you stage, you roll forward until you break the "Pre-Stage" lights on the tree. You then roll forward a little more and break the "Stage" lights. You can actually creep even a little further forward and turn off the "Pre-Stage" lights while the "Stage" lights are lit. For a valid race to start, only the "Stage" lights have to be lit, the "Pre-Stage" lights on the tree are more for the driver's reference only. This is called "Deep Staging"...getting as close as you can to the true starting line. The RT is the difference between the green light comming on and the "Stage" light going out by crossing the start line."

That said a lot. Don't be confused if my slips next TH are still erratic. I will try to place the emphasis on finding the best place to to stage.

The water box I decided to not use on Thursday because I was not chirping the tires or breaking them lose at all on starting so I don't think I need to heat em up for more traction. So even if I can start spinning the tires with a different technique there's still no need to go to the water.

Will, just to bury this subject is it ok to sell that AFPR? Never installed and cost $70! I painted it so I can't return it.
I greatly respect the generosity on this site. And this level of knowledge would be hard to find anywhere else.

_________________
2001 Bonneville SSEi. 1598xx mi.
great car. Wrecked


Burnt Bonny.

Note if you pull the injectors to obserbe fuel delivery...make sure you leave the plugs in and disconnect the ign. Believe me

You won't sell it to anyone on this forum. But you're welcom to try. When you try, you should clearly state that it will not fit the OEM location and is under-rated for every 3800 on this forum.

I can't think of an application for the AFPR other than maybe some carbureted car.

As far as your track times being all over the map, that's to be expected your first time out. I suspect it has alot more to do with HOW you launch than where you launch from (deep or shallow stage). You'll gain more experience the next time you go and your times will tighten up as you learn to do things exactly the same each time.

_________________

Click here for mod list for both cars
93 SSEi, 95 SLE (supercharged) 97 Buick LeSabre Limited
PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers

One thing I want to chime in on is that when I went drag racing for the first time, I didn't power brake at all. I just dug in and tried to keep the tires from chirping. My reasoning behind it was that the SSB wire on my transmission harness was loose, and that affects torque converter lockup. Thinking that the TC might not be in its best shape, I didn't want to stress it. Anyway, here's what my non-power braked SSEi got:
http://www.theradomir.com/irp512.html

My times and speeds are fairly consistent, and it was my first time ever drag racing. Because of all this, I think you do have a staging issue if consistency in the long run is not quite there. If you practice consistent launching, you'll get consistent times, I believe. Of course, my launching was bad, but its consistency got me consistent 1/4 mile times. You can constantly launch poorly or launch well, and if you can do a good launch, I see easy 16s in the future.

_________________
94 SSEi - Project car
99 SLE - Tuned with different parts and such
85 Porsche 944 - Daily driver
68 Chevy C-10 - Free truck! Needs parts.

Radomir, you would never see TCC lockup at WOT on a dragstrip anyway. Your problem would have been an issue only on the WAY to the track.

In addition, consistency from run to run is ALL about consistent launches. The first sixty feet are the critical. 60' times all over the map will net inconsistent ET's. The car is an automatic. After the launch, the car does it's own thing. You mash the throttle and steer.

The only REAL driver input is the launch.

_________________

Click here for mod list for both cars
93 SSEi, 95 SLE (supercharged) 97 Buick LeSabre Limited
PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers

mhfromphila wrote

"Spoiled94 did you have your traction control on or off ? "

my car is not traction control equipped

_________________
2001 Bonneville SSEi. 1598xx mi.
great car. Wrecked


Burnt Bonny.

Note if you pull the injectors to obserbe fuel delivery...make sure you leave the plugs in and disconnect the ign. Believe me

I just had a visit from one of our Gearheads passing through town, and he brought up a very good point.

Considering the trans problems you've had on this car for the last (almost) year, why are you running it on the dragstrip? Do you think the trans issues might be part of the cause for your inconsistent runs?

_________________

Click here for mod list for both cars
93 SSEi, 95 SLE (supercharged) 97 Buick LeSabre Limited
PontiacDad at WCBF '04: Cruise control? That's like surrendering!
Comprehensive guide to troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying Eaton Superchargers