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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:56 pm 
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Year and Trim: 2002 SSEI "Twitch"
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Is that the original PCM? You can't just throw one in there... and do a relearn.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:49 am 
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Location: Racine, Wisconsin
Year and Trim: 97.2 40th SLE
68 w/400
94 SSEi
Can't just throw what in? And ignition switch and lock cylinder?

Does ignition switch and lock cylinder have to match the PCM? Or is there a theft deterrent module that they have to match (I read that somewhere, might not be correct).

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1997.2 40th SLE-138k
1968 Bonneville 400ci w/TH-400-40k
1999 GMC Suburban SLT-191k
2005 Escalade 253k-GINA


nos4blood70 wrote:
Literally, cars are drugs.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:39 pm 
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Location: Racine, Wisconsin
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Soooo, after doing some more research it looks like my whole security system is effed up.

The car has the original PCM in it again. Would it need reprogram just from being disconnected? Or it should be fine?

Also, the original ignition cylinder only has ONE valet key, which can't be programmed without a master.

My new ignition, I guess does not match the Theft Deterrent Module which is a problem. So could I just swap the Theft Deterrent Module so the ignition exciter matches the Theft Deterrent Module. Will the PCM be able to learn these changes?

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Clay
1997.2 40th SLE-138k
1968 Bonneville 400ci w/TH-400-40k
1999 GMC Suburban SLT-191k
2005 Escalade 253k-GINA


nos4blood70 wrote:
Literally, cars are drugs.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 4:47 pm 
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Location: Racine, Wisconsin
Year and Trim: 97.2 40th SLE
68 w/400
94 SSEi
So I tried swapping the original key excited back so essentially just have a new ignition switch and key. It is NOT saying "starting disabled-theft" now it is just saying "service theft system".

Tried to do a relearn and security light would never go off.
Trying it again now.


Edit: security light won't turn off like its supposed to, according to the procedure.

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Clay
1997.2 40th SLE-138k
1968 Bonneville 400ci w/TH-400-40k
1999 GMC Suburban SLT-191k
2005 Escalade 253k-GINA


nos4blood70 wrote:
Literally, cars are drugs.


Last edited by 94SilverSSEi on Sun Apr 14, 2013 5:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 5:12 pm 
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Location: DeKalb, IL
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I don't remember what, but the light not turning off indicates something. Been a while since I dealt with S'curity. :lol:

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9x xxxxxx | ----------------- | --------------------- |
92 Pontiac Bonneville SSE | L67/4T60E | 74K mi | Med Slate Grey w/ Two-Tone Grey Int. | Low Miles Time Capsule / Storage Occupant
92 Chevy Lumina Z34 | LQ1/4T60E | 177k mi | Torch Red w/Grey Int. | Storage Occupant
03 Buick Park Avenue Ultra | L67/4T65E-HD | 194K | White Diamond Metallic w/Shale & Cashmere Int. | Rust Free Southern Sourced Summer Daily Driver
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 11:38 pm 
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Location: Racine, Wisconsin
Year and Trim: 97.2 40th SLE
68 w/400
94 SSEi
Quote:
Vehicle Theft Deterrent (VTD) Operation

When an ignition key is inserted into the ignition lock cylinder, the transponder embedded in the head of the key is energized by the exciter coils surrounding the ignition lock cylinder. The energized transponder transmits a signal that contains its unique value, which is received by the VTD Controller Module . The VTD Controller Module then compares this value to a value stored in memory and performs one of the following functions:

If the transponder value is correct, the VTD Controller Module sends a class 2 message containing the module's unique enable password to the PCM.
If the transponder value is incorrect, the VTD Controller Module sends a class 2 message containing a disable password to the PCM.
If the VTD Controller Module is unable to measure the ignition key transponder value for one second, due to a damaged or missing pellet or a damaged exciter, the VTD sends a class 2 message containing a disable password to the PCM

Important
If the VTD Controller Module is unable to measure the ignition key transponder value for 30 consecutive seconds, after the vehicle has started, the module will consider itself malfunctioning and enter a fail enable state and illuminate the Security Indicator. The vehicle will not stall or stop running. If the VTD Controller Module is in a fail enable state when the ignition is turned to OFF, it will remain fail enabled until the next time the vehicle is started. If the VTD Controller Module is fail enabled the Pass Key® III system is NOT active and the vehicle will start. The module WILL send its enable password even if a transponder value is not received. The VTD Controller Module will remain fail enabled until the module measures a valid key transponder value.


When the PCM receives a password from the VTD Controller Module, the PCM compares the password to a password stored in its memory (learned password) and performs one of the following functions:

If the PCM receives a correct system enable password, indicating a learned VTD Controller Module has a read a valid transponder value, fuel and starting are enabled.
If the PCM receives a system disable password, indicating a VTD Controller Module has a read an invalid transponder value, fuel and starting are disabled.
If the PCM receives an incorrect password, indicating a VTD Controller Module that has not been learned by the PCM, fuel and starting are disabled.
If the PCM has no communication with the VTD Controller Module, fuel and starting are disabled.

Important
If the PCM is unable to communicate with the VTD Controller Module (loss of class 2 state of health) after the vehicle has started, the module will consider itself malfunctioning and enter a fail enable state and illuminate the Security Indicator. The vehicle will not stall or stop running. If the PCM is in a fail enable state when the ignition is turned to OFF, it will remain fail enabled until the next time the vehicle is started. If the PCM is fail enabled the Pass Key® III system is NOT active and the vehicle will start. The PCM will remain fail enabled until class 2 communication with the VTD Controller Module is restored.


SECURITY Indicator Operation
The VTD Controller Module can command the instrument cluster to illuminate the SECURITY indicator only when the ignition key is in the ON position. If the PCM loses communication with the VTD Controller Module, the instrument cluster will also detect the loss of communication and will illuminate the SECURITY indicator. The SECURITY indicator can indicate both malfunctions - the indicator on steady, and tamper - the indicator flashes indicating unauthorized operation. Under the following conditions the SECURITY indicator may be commanded to illuminate.

SECURITY Indicator Stays Illuminated and Engine Starts
If the VTD Controller Module was unable to measure the ignition key transponder value or the PCM lost communication with the VTD Controller Module while the engine was last running, the indicator will remain illuminated during subsequent ignition cycles. This is to remind the driver that the vehicle theft deterrent system will not be functioning until the problem is corrected. The vehicle is fail enabled and will start.

SECURITY Indicator Illuminates when Engine is Running
If the VTD Controller Module is unable to measure the ignition key transponder value or the PCM loses communication with the VTD Controller Module while the engine is running, the indicator will be illuminated. If the key is turned to OFF, the vehicle will be fail enabled and will start if the condition still exists at the next attempt to start the vehicle.

SECURITY Indicator Illuminated and Engine Does Not Start
The VTD Controller Module or the PCM has detected a problem with the PASS-Key® III system. The VTD Controller Module is unable to measure the ignition key transponder value. The System is in Learn Mode, refer to Programming Theft Deterrent System Components .


SECURITY Indicator Flashes and Engine Does Not Start
The VTD Controller Module has measured an incorrect transponder value when the ignition key is turned to the ON position. The transponder has not been learned by the VTD Controller Module. This is considered a tamper condition by the Module.

SECURITY LED
The VTD controller Module commands the instrument cluster to illuminate the theft LED located in the interior dimming switch. The instrument cluster receives a class II message from the VTD controller module to control this LED. It is intended to be used as another theft deterrent and indicate that the VTD system is in the ARMED state of readiness.



I found something in a very extensive search. It seems there is a "problem" with the passkey system.

So I'm thinking either the Key or the Theft Deterrent Module itself may have went bad.

From what I am reading it looks like if I swap the Rear Integration Module as well as the dash integration module so that they match the key and ignition exciter that I swapped it, the only non-matching part of the theft system would be the PCM would then I should be able to do a security relearn and it SHOULD learn the key. Hopefully :eek:

Have to try this when I can get some free time to go look at the car again.

_________________
Clay
1997.2 40th SLE-138k
1968 Bonneville 400ci w/TH-400-40k
1999 GMC Suburban SLT-191k
2005 Escalade 253k-GINA


nos4blood70 wrote:
Literally, cars are drugs.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:03 am 
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Location: IL
Year and Trim: 2002 SSEI "Twitch"
Intense LIII
If you have a friendly shop with a scanner, just have them reprogram everything to work together and call it a day. This is what I thought was going on... you have parts and pieces that do not recognize each other. There is also a way to disable some systems with passkey but I don't know if you can do that with your model.

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2002 SSEI "Twitch"
INTENSE™ Fenderwell Intake Kit
INTENSE™ Modular Pulley System with 3.40" Pulley -
SD Headers H-Flow Cat
WB 255 Siemens 60.0 (65.0) pound/hour Fuel Injectors
Yella Terra 1.9 90# Manley Retainers
L32 LIM & Gen V Blower N* TB


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:10 am 
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Location: Racine, Wisconsin
Year and Trim: 97.2 40th SLE
68 w/400
94 SSEi
I know I wish I had vats I would just bypass this garbage system.

Don't know any shops that have a tech II I'd have to take it to the dealer and tow it there at that. Think I'm going to try to swap those other parts over. (that should also give me a working keyless entry system) but if that doesn't work. I will end up having to take it to the dealer. ; (

_________________
Clay
1997.2 40th SLE-138k
1968 Bonneville 400ci w/TH-400-40k
1999 GMC Suburban SLT-191k
2005 Escalade 253k-GINA


nos4blood70 wrote:
Literally, cars are drugs.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 11:10 pm 
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Location: Racine, Wisconsin
Year and Trim: 97.2 40th SLE
68 w/400
94 SSEi
Well, I now own this car. Was a project for my lil bro. I guess it'll be a good daily driver. Still needs some work but the drivetrain is rock solid.

Just have to have it towed somewhere that has a Tech II now, was considering buying one but don't know if it'd be worth the money but it would be very helpful in cases like this.

_________________
Clay
1997.2 40th SLE-138k
1968 Bonneville 400ci w/TH-400-40k
1999 GMC Suburban SLT-191k
2005 Escalade 253k-GINA


nos4blood70 wrote:
Literally, cars are drugs.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:39 am 
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Location: Charlotte, NC
Year and Trim: 96 SSEi- 157K
good grief those seats! congrats on getting it started!! :D and hats off to you for getting anything done on a car in that weather. I have had a hard time getting my butt outside to work on my project car and it's been in the teens and 20's.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:59 am 
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Location: Racine, Wisconsin
Year and Trim: 97.2 40th SLE
68 w/400
94 SSEi
Yeah the seats were definitely a labor of love. I just hope whoever buys it appreciates all the work that's been put in it and takes care of it, unlike the previous owner.

This car was definitely a learning lesson. (That I'll never do again, haha)

And oddly enough, the broken gas gauge seems to have magically fixed itself after sitting for a year. Reads fine now.

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Clay
1997.2 40th SLE-138k
1968 Bonneville 400ci w/TH-400-40k
1999 GMC Suburban SLT-191k
2005 Escalade 253k-GINA


nos4blood70 wrote:
Literally, cars are drugs.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 6:19 pm 
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Did swapping those modules work? I'm having the problem.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:03 am 
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Since this thread is almost 2 years old, you may not get a response from the OP, and if he's as old as Archon he probably won't remember anyway.
:poke:
I recommend you start a new thread and provide the details of your problem.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 1:11 pm 
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